Fox cub trapped in snare is kept alive by its mother (From Southend Standard)

Hope you follow this story up to let us know if foxy makes it. Is hard to believe how cruel some people can be, setting these traps for defenceless animals.

I had an adult fox make its way into my front room once, I was upstairs and heard my cat miaowing and came downstairs to find the fox under cowering behind my TV. Stank my front room out for days, but I still wouldn't dream of setting traps.

Snares are perfectly legal in the UK (free running). How can we allow this despicable practice in the countryside, where thousands of animals are killed by snares and other cruel measures, by the weird minority of extremist country folk who think the world is all theirs and nothing else has a right to be here! Yet complain when the very same tactics are used in our towns? All forms of animal cruelty should be banned. Whilst we still allow these psychos to pick and choose what law they abide by, we will always have them getting their kicks harming defensless creatures, often for fun.

Flog them I say, give the scum a taste of their own medicine and see how keen they are to continue after that!

As long as people will shed the blood of innocent creatures there can be no peace, no liberty, no harmony between people. Slaughter and justice cannot dwell together.
--Isaac Bashevis Singer

Well said Colleen. If they should ever find the culprit(s) they should be put in a snare and left to see how they like it.The reason for the tameness and population explosion of foxes is due to humans leaving carelessly discarded litter readily available to hungry foxes!I hope this dear little fellow recovers well and is "back on his paws" soon!

If you think that we should snare the humans who snare the foxes then do you also think that we should run over every human that runs over a fox in the road. More foxes are killed every day on the roads than are killed by any other means. Maybe we should ban all cars too, to save the cute little creatures? Foxes are vermin and we should shoot the lot of them.

Nebs wrote:
If you think that we should snare the humans who snare the foxes then do you also think that we should run over every human that runs over a fox in the road. More foxes are killed every day on the roads than are killed by any other means. Maybe we should ban all cars too, to save the cute little creatures? Foxes are vermin and we should shoot the lot of them.

Try not to be completely daft and illogical, in your daft and illogical statement. Vermin can equally be applied to humans "an objectionable or obnoxious person, or such persons collectively".. If it's OK to kill the wildlife, usually for a warped sense of pleasure, it should also be ok to treat said humans the same, they are a far worse problem than any wildlife.

Simple fact is, foxes, like most wildlife, cause the vast majority of us no problems at all. Why should we tolerate the intolerant few who are incapable of sane, reasoned thinking when it comes to wildlife?

Probably worth noting, this *population explosion* claim, so often used to justify the slaughter of wildlife, can equally be applied to humans, and is causing very real problems as opposed to imagined! When will we start to control our own verminous populations? I wonder then will the bullys be so keen on population control when it might be their necks on the line!

Foxes do a great job in clearing up. Rats and mice are rarely seen where you have a resident fox. They eat the scraps thrown away carelessly by humans. Only the dominant male and female breed, the others bring the food. So there is never an explosion of foxes around. 'Love the Fox!

ADSUM wrote:
Foxes do a great job in clearing up. Rats and mice are rarely seen where you have a resident fox. They eat the scraps thrown away carelessly by humans. Only the dominant male and female breed, the others bring the food. So there is never an explosion of foxes around. 'Love the Fox!

That's a very good point. Much of the *claim* against foxes is pure fiction. They use the very same rubbish to justify killing rats, mice, pigeons, rabbits, birds... The fox is the best natural pest control we have. I guess they hope we dont notice the sums dont add up with their tall stories.

Anyone who claims they cannot live with wildlife, either town or country, should be made to live in a high rise, see if that cures their phobia.

Colleen G wrote:
Snares are perfectly legal in the UK (free running). How can we allow this despicable practice in the countryside, where thousands of animals are killed by snares and other cruel measures, by the weird minority of extremist country folk who think the world is all theirs and nothing else has a right to be here! Yet complain when the very same tactics are used in our towns? All forms of animal cruelty should be banned. Whilst we still allow these psychos to pick and choose what law they abide by, we will always have them getting their kicks harming defensless creatures, often for fun. Flog them I say, give the scum a taste of their own medicine and see how keen they are to continue after that! As long as people will shed the blood of innocent creatures there can be no peace, no liberty, no harmony between people. Slaughter and justice cannot dwell together. --Isaac Bashevis Singer

I konw it's usually ladies first but sorry Colleen, move over please, I want to be the first to pick up the 'strap' and flog these evil b-----d's. This punishment should be applied to many who deserve it.

I would rather live in the country with the wildlife than live in the town with the sort of scum that exist there.

Oi, I live in the town! And the scum in the country are far more cruel, as killing is a daily ritual to some of them.

As with most warped and weird people, thankfully they are a minority, town or country. The pro hunt nuts are ruining the countryside for tourism..who wants to go visit the country and watch nutcases shooting wildlife for fun! That area would never get my tourist dollars again.

I hope the idiots who set the snare get caught and suffer the same as the poor fox which i really hope makes a full recovery.I have foxes at the bottom of my garden they dont cause any problems at all

Shoot the foxes it is quicker, much fairer especially for the chickens that they kill for the fun of it.

Anyway one outbreak of rabies then the gun will soon cure the fox problems which are currently engulfing suburban life in homes that have been built for decades.

And leave the country folk alone they actually feed us in case you have forgotten and they do not all kill for fun.

If you're stupid enough to leave chickens unprotected, why blame the fox? Bit like leaving your kids to roam the streets and not expecting them to get harmed!

The only fox problems, or even rat problems are inside the heads of people like you. Oh and of course the pest control companies who regularly do scaremongering reports... I wonder why! It feeds village idiots fear, and ensures they, like the rest of us, are forced to pay billions annually to fund the pest control industry.

Most of us have no problems with rats, foxes or any other wildlife. Just seeing an animal doesnt make it a problem... try to look beyond your empty glass.

Colleen G wrote:
If you're stupid enough to leave chickens unprotected, why blame the fox? Bit like leaving your kids to roam the streets and not expecting them to get harmed!

The only fox problems, or even rat problems are inside the heads of people like you. Oh and of course the pest control companies who regularly do scaremongering reports... I wonder why! It feeds village idiots fear, and ensures they, like the rest of us, are forced to pay billions annually to fund the pest control industry.

Most of us have no problems with rats, foxes or any other wildlife. Just seeing an animal doesnt make it a problem... try to look beyond your empty glass.

book up an appointment ASAP.

Colleen, you have called me daft. Do you resort to personal abuse with everyone who disagrees with your point of view.
On the subject of logic, you stated that all forms of animal cruelty should be banned, and then go on to say that people should be flogged. Where is the logic in that?
You are right when you say that foxes cause most of us no harm at all. But they do, therefore, cause harm to some.
If killing animals is cruel then get rid of all the foxes and more chickens will be saved, with the net result of less animal deaths. Shooting then is the most humane way.

Nebs wrote:
Colleen, you have called me daft. Do you resort to personal abuse with everyone who disagrees with your point of view. On the subject of logic, you stated that all forms of animal cruelty should be banned, and then go on to say that people should be flogged. Where is the logic in that? You are right when you say that foxes cause most of us no harm at all. But they do, therefore, cause harm to some. If killing animals is cruel then get rid of all the foxes and more chickens will be saved, with the net result of less animal deaths. Shooting then is the most humane way.

Nothing abusive about calling daft people daft. Dont be so touchy.

Cruelty should be banned period, doesnt matter what kind of animals, even human!

Live by the sword, die by the sword. Some violent, psychotic, neurotic people only understand violence, so they need to be treated the same if they are to ever see the light. That's called justice! No, the most humane way is to leave the wildlife be, and stop using it as a scapegoat for human incompetence and intolerance.

The only people who think foxes need controlling are the odd weirdo, and the pest controllers making work for themselves.

Well said Colleen. The voice of reason. I had a similar debate last year on the Daily Mail message boards. I love foxes. I had one come into the garden last summer and sat next to me in my deckchair. I know they leave smelly deposits in the garden but we all have to drop our waste don't we?

It puzzles me when I see kind people feeling sorry for foxes etc when they do not seem to feel for the gentle lambs, pigs, cattle and chicken which are slaughtered on a vast scale to provide food in the mistaken belief that meat is essential for the survival of human beings.

Steve Rowe wrote:
It puzzles me when I see kind people feeling sorry for foxes etc when they do not seem to feel for the gentle lambs, pigs, cattle and chicken which are slaughtered on a vast scale to provide food in the mistaken belief that meat is essential for the survival of human beings.

That's the way people have been conditioned...meat doesnt come from animals, it comes from Tesco....!! I found giving up meat as difficult as giving up smoking. both examples of just how weak we are. Quite shameful really. We put too much faith in the establishment.

Hi Colleen G. You are a wise and perceptive person. Your views and comments are very interesting and thought-provoking. I always pay attention to what you say.

Steve Rowe wrote:
It puzzles me when I see kind people feeling sorry for foxes etc when they do not seem to feel for the gentle lambs, pigs, cattle and chicken which are slaughtered on a vast scale to provide food in the mistaken belief that meat is essential for the survival of human beings.

For me, it's the gratuitous nature of killing foxes (and leaving them to suffer for two weeks...) that bothers me, rather than the killing per se. Am not sure anyone thinks that meat is "essential" for the survival of human beings. Personally, I don't eat anything that has been reared in a cruel way (e.g. I don't eat non free-range meat), and I don't eat young animals such as lamb, but I guess everyone has to come to their own decision about what they feel comfortable with. Even Ray Mears eats meat, and I don't think anyone could claim he's not in touch with nature.

Mark D. You are right. Even worthy people eat meat - without batting an eyelid, I suppose. I think the Archbishop of Canterbury and the Pope also eat meat (unless somebody corrects me).

I too Love Foxes and yet to hear of one of them killing Pigs, or Cattle, even sheep when ignorant Dog owners allow theirs dogs to roam willy-nilly, regardless of what damage THEY do, only to go on and blame Fred Fox as usual.

I have a dog that chases birds and especially Jackdaws and Pigeons, but then it was said that he was kicked out on the street and running wild for weeks, scavenging food where possible and before I was fortunate enough to rehome him.

Last weekend, I had Tremendous pleasure in seeing 3 x Fox cubs, with one less than 6 feet away. I would Love one as a Pet and regardless of the 'Experts' who claim they THINK rather than actually KNOW anything about them, merely trying to make a name for themselves in front of others.

I now hope the THUG who set that snare gets caught and put in one.

Steve Rowe wrote:
Hi Colleen G. You are a wise and perceptive person. Your views and comments are very interesting and thought-provoking. I always pay attention to what you say.

I'm honoured. Wisdom is within us all, but you can only find it with open eyes.

"How long, O naive ones, will you love simplicity?

And scoffers delight themselves in scoffing,

And fools hate knowledge?

How long indeed.

Steve Rowe wrote:
Mark D. You are right. Even worthy people eat meat - without batting an eyelid, I suppose. I think the Archbishop of Canterbury and the Pope also eat meat (unless somebody corrects me).

The eating of meat isnt the issue...it's how the meat is raised that's the issue. We do not need to be heartless, cruel or enjoy suffering. We choose too. Mostly through ignorance.

The bible itself is unclear on eating meat, so who could condemn another for doing so?

In my ideal world we would all be veggie, but ideals are few and far between...in the meantime we just have to get on with it.

Trainman wrote:
I too Love Foxes and yet to hear of one of them killing Pigs, or Cattle, even sheep when ignorant Dog owners allow theirs dogs to roam willy-nilly, regardless of what damage THEY do, only to go on and blame Fred Fox as usual. I have a dog that chases birds and especially Jackdaws and Pigeons, but then it was said that he was kicked out on the street and running wild for weeks, scavenging food where possible and before I was fortunate enough to rehome him. Last weekend, I had Tremendous pleasure in seeing 3 x Fox cubs, with one less than 6 feet away. I would Love one as a Pet and regardless of the 'Experts' who claim they THINK rather than actually KNOW anything about them, merely trying to make a name for themselves in front of others. I now hope the THUG who set that snare gets caught and put in one.

Sadly old foxey is the scapegoat for many deaths in the countryside. The biggest myth is from sheep farmers claiming the lambs they have force bred to be born in the middle of winter, and often die as a consequence, were killed by foxes. In reality the foxes merely scavenge on the abundence of death in the lambing fields already. Farmer doesnt care. He hides the fact his farming practice is cruel, and he also gets to blame an animal he doesnt want to share the countryside with!

Dogs are like children. Unless disciplined they will run wild, it's just what they do.

I'm not in favour of snaring foxes as it's cruel, but something needs to be done about them as they are a massive problem. They've dug a series of burrows underneath or shed in the garden, and leave a lot of nasty droppings around the place. They rip up rubbish bags and scatter the contents across the lawn, and in the summer make horrific yelping noises as they mate on the lawn.

Going to have to put ultrasonic equipment out in the garden to scare the buggers away!

DannyK86 wrote:
I'm not in favour of snaring foxes as it's cruel, but something needs to be done about them as they are a massive problem. They've dug a series of burrows underneath or shed in the garden, and leave a lot of nasty droppings around the place. They rip up rubbish bags and scatter the contents across the lawn, and in the summer make horrific yelping noises as they mate on the lawn. Going to have to put ultrasonic equipment out in the garden to scare the buggers away!

If you have trouble in particular areas get yourself a small electric fence that runs off 12v battery..lasts forever and works very well on anything with four legs.

As for droppings, they're no worse than cats, dogs etc.. Rubbish bags, don't leave out until morning etc Animals need to live in this world just as much as we do. If you think they are inconvenient, imagine what they think of us! stick the fence up round your shed, or if you want to exclude the garden, stick it round the garden perimeter.

See
tinyurl.com/cohzzt

for some interesting advice.

PS: DONT ever, never, ever, test the fence by touching it..it wont kill you but it sure as hell will make you jump LOL

Colleen G wrote:

DannyK86 wrote: I'm not in favour of snaring foxes as it's cruel, but something needs to be done about them as they are a massive problem. They've dug a series of burrows underneath or shed in the garden, and leave a lot of nasty droppings around the place. They rip up rubbish bags and scatter the contents across the lawn, and in the summer make horrific yelping noises as they mate on the lawn. Going to have to put ultrasonic equipment out in the garden to scare the buggers away!

If you have trouble in particular areas get yourself a small electric fence that runs off 12v battery..lasts forever and works very well on anything with four legs. As for droppings, they're no worse than cats, dogs etc.. Rubbish bags, don't leave out until morning etc Animals need to live in this world just as much as we do. If you think they are inconvenient, imagine what they think of us! stick the fence up round your shed, or if you want to exclude the garden, stick it round the garden perimeter. See tinyurl.com/cohzzt for some interesting advice. PS: DONT ever, never, ever, test the fence by touching it..it wont kill you but it sure as hell will make you jump LOL

Thanks for the advice - that's not a bad idea actually, as we have problems with roaming cats as well!

You're welcome. Just remember when you plan your wiring route, it must not earth anywhere or it wont work properly ie long grass,branches etc..so keep your grass/weeds short.... dont go lashing out for triple wire kits etc....just try single wire at about a foot high to start with, see how you get on, and raise or lower it as needs must. You can of course use it to keep your own pets within your bonudary too. Much cheaper than fencing.

If you're really keen, make your own electric fencing out of hobby kits.

Course we must also remember what our countryside fox cousins have to endure at the hands of man already.

tinyurl.com/q9fnbc

Gruesome catalogue of wildlife persecution exposed
Posted: 11 May 2009

Graphic footage of foxes struggling in drag snares, believed to be the first of its kind and a mass death pit of rotting carcasses on an estate with links to the royal family, are just some of the gruesome finds revealed in a damning expose into predator control practices in the UK.
A League Against Cruel Sports investigation examines the mass slaughter of wildlife happening up and down the country, much of which is illegal or in breach of guidelines designed to prevent unnecessary cruelty and suffering.

War on Wildlife published today names and shames sporting estates, including some of the country’s most prestigious, which are systematically wiping out wildlife at an unprecedented rate for the financial gain which can be generated from commercial shooting.

Throughout last year, League investigators visited a number of estates – some already well known offenders, others as a result of information from the public – all waging war on wildlife. On land near to Harewood House, home to the Queen’s cousin the Earl of Harewood, investigators found evidence showing the shocking extent of wildlife persecution including a ‘death pit’ with in excess of 100 rotting animal carcasses including foxes, squirrels and rabbits among others presumably being used as bait for nearby traps. In Nottinghamshire graphic footage was obtained showing two foxes struggling desperately to escape from snares set on drag poles – a practice which goes against the industry’s code of best practice.

These examples are just the tip of the iceberg with a catalogue of grim discoveries being made, including rotting animal carcasses dumped as bait, snares set of dragpoles over water courses, and dead birds strung up on ‘gibbet lines’.

The League’s shooting campaigner Katy Roberts said, “It is quite positively sickening what we have uncovered over the course of our investigations. Wildlife is being systematically wiped out in a brutal fashion to protect game birds being reared for commercial shooting and ultimately line the pockets of the estate owners. Mass slaughter on this scale is simply not acceptable.”

Parliamentary and political officer Joshua Kaile added, “The UK Government must address the problems associated with commercial shooting as a matter of urgency and we will be stepping up our political campaigning for a ban on snares in England and Wales to ensure this outdated practice is resigned to the history books once and for all.”

Read the report
tinyurl.com/ppzm8u

Colleen G wrote:

Nebs wrote: If you think that we should snare the humans who snare the foxes then do you also think that we should run over every human that runs over a fox in the road. More foxes are killed every day on the roads than are killed by any other means. Maybe we should ban all cars too, to save the cute little creatures? Foxes are vermin and we should shoot the lot of them.

Try not to be completely daft and illogical, in your daft and illogical statement. Vermin can equally be applied to humans "an objectionable or obnoxious person, or such persons collectively".. If it's OK to kill the wildlife, usually for a warped sense of pleasure, it should also be ok to treat said humans the same, they are a far worse problem than any wildlife. Simple fact is, foxes, like most wildlife, cause the vast majority of us no problems at all. Why should we tolerate the intolerant few who are incapable of sane, reasoned thinking when it comes to wildlife?

Colleen, I disagree that my post is "daft and illogical". It may not accord with your point of view, but that does not make it daft. And it follows your argument to deduce the conclusion (which is, after all, one of the things that the study of logic is about) that car drivers should be run over. Where is the failure in the logic? I don't agree that the conclusion is a satisfactory punishment for the action, but it is the conclusion that logically follows from your statements and the premise that foxes are killed by cars.

If you are going to talk about logic, perhaps you can reconcile the logic between two of your statements: "Cruelty should be banned period, doesnt matter what kind of animals, even human" and "Flog them I say". Where is the logic in that? Or is flogging not cruel, in which case do you believe that it is acceptable to flog foxes (I don't, but following the logic of your argument suggests that you must believe it to be acceptable)?

You also say "Live by the sword, die by the sword. Some violent, psychotic, neurotic people only understand violence, so they need to be treated the same if they are to ever see the light." So much for Cruelty should be banned Period! Are you advocating that every crime of violence should be punished by committing an equally violent act against the offender? Should those suffering from psychosis only be treated by others with the same ailment? (actually, that would probably be quite fun to watch, two druggie cannabis smokers trying to cure each other).

And surely "Live by the sword, die by the sword" could equally apply to foxes that kill chickens, as you think it should apply to humans. Or is that not logical?